Quisp's 2011-12 Los Angeles Kings
The other day fellow blogger Quisp had an excellent question: with all the different projects and prospects in the Kings' system, how can the Kings possibly get them all into the NHL in the next few years? We both decided to write down our best guesses without looking at the other person's line-up and then compare them. You can see my correct prediction over at Jewels From the Crown while Quisp's horribly inaccurate line-up is below. A few things to note about Quisp's line-up:
-He has Andrei Loktionov above Brayden Schenn and both of them above Jarret Stoll.
-He has Kyle Clifford making the team.
-Jordan Nolan? Jake Muzzin?
I asked Quisp a few questions about his line-up and he'll answer them in the comments soon. What do you guys think? Which prospects will make the team and which ones will be left behind?
Alexander Frolov/Andrei Loktionov/Oscar Moller
Kyle Clifford/Brayden Schenn/Dustin Brown
Richard Clune/Jarret Stoll/Brad Richardson
(Jordan Nolan)
Rob Scuderi/Drew Doughty
Jack Johnson/Jake Muzzin
Vyacheslav Voynov/Matt Greene
(Thomas Hickey)
Jonathan Bernier
Jonathan Quick
Questions for Quisp:
1. Looking at your line-up, it seems like you're pretty bullish on Andrei Loktionov and Jake Muzzin. What is it about these guys that tickles your fancy?
2. Where do you see Wayne Simmonds being in 2 years? Is he on the top line because he doesn't need the puck or do you see him being more talented than Oscar Moller or Dustin Brown?
3. Clifford-Schenn-Brown. I don't have a question, that's just a really cool line.
4. Jordan Nolan is going to someday make the team? Seriously?
5. How good do you see this team being in the 11-12 season?
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Discuss.
If I accidentally trip and fall down and I have a boner and I fall into a guy's butt repeatedly is that gay?
I may need to steal this post for future reuse.
It takes a big man to cry and it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man. -Jamie Baker
Proud member of the "Keep Marleau Forever" Club
by Lurker Shark on Mar 15, 2010 10:39 PM PDT up reply actions
Muzzin
The way I see it, there will be at least one big mean defenseman graduating by two seasons from now. The choices are Teubert, Campbell and Muzzin. Muzzin, who just completed a personal-best season, and was voted MVP of his team, has the leadership qualities that Teubert appears to lack (Tuebert’s leadership skills canceled out by madness). I have only seen Muzzin on YouTube clips and half of one pay-per-view CHL game. But he looks better than Teubert to me. And I choose to think Lombardi will be able to grow at least one big “tree” d-man by then. So Muzzin it is.
Wait till this year.
Loktionov
When he was playing in Windsor, I saw him make passes (in the Memorial Cup, I forget which game) that literally caused the crowd to gasp. Every time I see Kopitar get ready to make one of his mega-telegrapho passes, which everyone in the world sees coming, I think of Loktionov, whose fake shot passes and fake pass passes are mesmerizing.
Yes, he is short. And he also needs to put on some muscle, like Moller does. The Manchester coach had a great quote about him, which was something to the effect of “watching him skate, it’s like he’s gliding on air.” That sounds kind of lame, actually. But it wasn’t.
Your idea of putting him on the wing is probably closer to reality, but WTF, it’s my little fantasy. Parse/Loktionov/Moller were an insanely good line for the first few weeks of the season, before they all were called up. And I do like the idea of giving Frolov someone to talk to.
And yes, of course I know that Frolov is possibly moving on. Feel free to put Marleau in his place.
Wait till this year.
if the Sharks win the cup, maybe he stays, but I don't know
if they don’t, Marleau probably leaves.
if they lose in the first round, I think he’s gone.
if he’s gone, I think he’ll go to the Kings, if Lombardi is ready and willing.
since Lombardi drafted him and likes him and knows him, I think he’ll be willing.
Wait till this year.
I don’t know if Marleau will leave the Sharks. After the season he is having, his Olympics, and the fact he will get virtually none of the blame if the Sharks flame out (cause Joe and Nabby are gonna bear the brunt of it if it happens), it seems unlikely. Unless Nabby carries the Sharks himself with a string of 2-1 wins all the way to the Cup, I don’t see DW picking Nabby over Marleau in the summer.
Put another way, DW is gonna have a hell of a time trying to replace his top goal scorer, top penalty killer, the only guy on his team that can create offense on his own, and best two way forward 5v5. I think you see Setoguchi, Nabby, and Clowe leave before you see Marleau slip free.
(This is all assuming Marleau wants to stay, which is what I think you guys are getting at. That said, I think Marleau is smart enough to know that for all the crap he got from the SJ media while he was captain, he will get double the pressure wherever else he goes as a big FA signing. The SJ media is pretty tame compared to nearly every other market).
Simmonds
Well, I put him with Kopitar because Brown sucks with Kopitar. You could flip my first and second lines, really. They’re 1a and 1b. Simmonds I see as being what Brown was supposed to be but isn’t. He’s also kind of Ryan Smyth Jr with more energy.
I don’t think he’s better than Moller, no. He’s physically more mature, and obviously bigger. Also will be wearing the A at some point, I think.
Having said what I said about Brown, I don’t think Simmonds is better than Brown exactly. I just see him being a more likely top six winger than Brown. Brown is, and I mean this as a positive in every way, the best 3rd line RW in the world. Maybe the ideal third line RW.
Wait till this year.
I actually dream of the day the Kings ice a line of Clifford-Schenn-Simmonds. I believe this line will fulfill Lombardi’s quest to replicate the Scott Thornton-Mike Ricci-Niklas Sundstrom line he has alluded to in past conversations with Rich Hammond. This line also has the potential to be the Kings version of the Cooke-Staal-Kennedy line but our LW will actually drop his gloves and not turtle, our C may actually be the best hockey player in his family and our RW doesn’t look like an English bulldog… I can’t wait.
I don't think Brown sucks with Kopitar...
I think Brown sucks with Smyth… Too much similarities in their respective games…
Jordan Nolan
To be fair, I’ve got Nolan in the Zeiler press box spot. Somebody has to be the 13th/14th forward. It’s not going to be Moller or Loktionov or Schenn. I like what I’ve seen from Nolan in the 45 seconds I’ve seen him. I’m not projecting higher than fourth line or anything. I’m not insane.
Wait till this year.
Clifford
Very nearly made the team this year, as an 18 year old. In the OHL, his point totals have literally doubled every season, from 15 to 28 to 57 this year. And he has another year of junior eligibility left. The kid is literally the epitome of the Dean Lombardi player, crash and bang blue paint nose dirty Canadian kid with offensive skills that are growing exponentially. Also, we need a good #13.
Wait till this year.
Loktionov above Schenn and both above Stoll
Well, that’s a good point. And I think you’re identifying an interesting area, I would say “problem,” but it’s a good one to have. Loktionov and Schenn both project top six and are both centers. They can both play wing if need be. Schenn can play the two way game and could be a good fit on the third unit until he grows into the C2 spot. But Loktionov doesn’t fit on a bottom-six line (unless you’re going for a third speed unit, a la Millen/Donnelly). Stoll, meanwhile, is not a top-six forward; he’s a third line center, really. If Loktionov turns out not to be ready year after next, then my line-up looks cleaner, as Stoll or Schenn can both work in either the second and third lines. Stoll on the fourth line looks weird, I know. But in my configuration, it’s really more of an alt. line, where it would be Stoll and someone…RIchardson? …as a pair, and a rotation of deserving players (Frolov, etc.) getting double-shifted.
Wait till this year.
I had to laugh when I saw that Stoll has been dropped to the 4th line today
http://www.lakingsnetwork.com/hammond/?p=4704
not that this means anything, but it’s funny.
Wait till this year.
It’s awesome, though, and I was hoping it would happen. Stoll’s a special teams player, not a 5-on-5 guy, and if Modin-Handzus-Simmonds is going to be our shutdown line it makes sense to try to get as much offense from our 2nd line as possible. Richardson and Brown have a lot of chemistry and Fro and Richardson have chemistry, so I think it’ll work pretty well. I wouldn’t be surprised if Stoll ends up with more TOI than Richardson, though.
The West Coast is the Best Coast.
That doesn’t necessarily seem that bad. I’m surprised a number of these guys are on this liist for 11-12 though. That seems a bit too soon for me to have Loktionov, Clifford, Schenn, Muzzin, AND Voynov. Five of those new guys has me a little bit concerned, but I don’t know enough about all these guys to pass judgment.
I’m also not sure that Handzus won’t re-sign after his contract expires (after 10-11 season, I believe). Certainly not at the $4M cap hit he is for this contract, but I like what he does defensively, and he’s a better option (at least this year) on faceoffs than Kopitar.
I am also a bit surprised to see Frolov on your list here. I love him so much, and wouldn’t move him except for a huge impact player like Kovalchuk, but everybody’s saying he won’t be back, and Rich Hammond put it at less than 50%. But we’ll see.
Denis Gauthier sucks at hockey... and life.
All good points
- as for the high number of prospects on the list for 11-12, it’s true I err on the side of optimism. But, let’s see, last year we had Doughty, Moller, Simmonds, Quincey, Drewiske and Quick, all rookies who “stuck.” (Quincey was not technically a rookie, as he had played the minimum 6 games in each of the two previous seasons; but he was really just as much a rookie as the others.) Now that, six rookies, is a lot. This year, we’ve got … Clune, Parse … as far as players who “stuck.” I thought Segal looked better than most people thought, and he’s playing in Dallas, so … you might count him. If you consider the last two seasons, that’s an average of four per year. Next year I think/hope one of Hickey or Voynov makes it, and I also hope Muzzin makes it … actually, wait, all of the guys you mentioned as being too soon for 11-12, I think might make the team in 10-11, so I’m ever crazier than you thought.
I don’t think they’ll ALL make it this fall. Probably Schenn, Clifford (the last cuts from this year) and one of Muzzin, Hickey or Voynov have the best shots. But I’m kind of spending my uncertainty on this fall, and am much more hopeful for the year after. I wouldn’t be surprised if some of them don’t ripen until 12-13.
- Handzus. Yes, I would love that. Sign Handzus three years at $2MM or something. I do think that would require trading Stoll though. For one thing, if you add up the cap figures of my 11-12 team, it’s likely to be right around $57-58MM. You won’t be able to have both Stoll and Handzus (and Schenn, Doughty, Johnson, Moller, Simmonds — all on bonus-laden ELCs or spanking new big $$$ contracts).
- Frolov. I’m not predicting whether he returns or not. I think he wants to return. If the Kings go deep in the playoffs, I think he will take a home-town discount. If he’s willing to take $10MM over three years, I think DL will sign him. If not, DL will go after Marleau. Anyway, I wasn’t willing to leave Frolov out for the purpose of this exercise. Williams could easily re-sign, too, but I chose to leave him off. Frankly, either of those could go either way.
Wait till this year.
So, how good is this team 11-12?
A Chicago/SJ powerhouse? A PHX/COL team of young up and comers? I actually think that this team could be the new VAN, assuming Bernier develops as expected (I don’t think he will be Louongo, but Steve Mason? Pekka Rinne? That will do for a roster this talented).
Certainly fighting for home ice advantage in the first round. Take Marleau off the Sharks and put him on the Kings and I think you see a switch at the top of the Pacific.
I’m pretty sure one of Voinov, Hickey, or Tuebert (hopefully) gets traded away eventually for a picks. You don’t really see a whole lot of good teams trading players for draft picks while they’re good but obviously not all of our prospects are going to make it. I think Dean can hopefully manage the cap well enough that we won’t have to give prospects away through waivers (Quincey). Voinov, Loktionov, Schenn, and Clifford all look awesome. I think Bernier has better potential than Quick, but Quick seems to have a better attitude for a goalie (although plenty of assholes are/were decent goalies-Belfour, Roy, RudyKelly). It is going to be very interesting to watch the goalie situation play out.

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